rhinoexpress, check out the timing. make sure the timing is set right. wat year model is the atv...

 

Did you try taking the filter off then install the carb back on the intake boot? If it keeps running then put the filter back on if it dies then the filter is the problem. Or if you have a buddy with the same quad borrow theirs to see if you can duplicate the problem.

 

My King Quad 300 takes a while to start too even on a warm day. I put it half choke then start it. Let it idle half choke for a few minutes then turn the choke off put it in gear right away then go. Give it a try.

 

if u can i would try ducktape on the intake boot it should seal enough to see if thats the problem

 

Ok, to answer the first question, I believe it is 1997 KQ. I got a used petcock for it and I have checked thoroughly, testing by removing the vacuum line and the diaphram quits working. So, i know the petcock is working properly. Onto the intake boot I did find the left machine screw was not turning in the whole way so I bought two new allen head bolts 6mmX1.5mm and was able to tighten the intake boot down. After doing that I was able to adjust the idle better but still not as much as it did when I initially got it running. Oh and now I can put on the boot from the carb to the airbox with the air filter inside and it will run through the gears without any hesitation or missing. The only problem that remains is the hard starting. I read an article that the fuel pump may be too weak. The quad has sat for about 5 years prior to me working on it. So I have no idea if the fuel pump is pumping enough pressure as it is? I have taken the fuel line off at the carb and hit the starter and the fuel delivery is not constant(like a garden host full blast) but oscillating(intermittant) with the cycling of the engine. I don't know anything about fuel pumps since all the quads and motorcycles I have worked on previously have been gravity feed? My next step would be to see if I can take the fuel pump apart and clean it. There was no gas in the tank when my friend brought it and it was clean in the bottom, the fuel petcock was clean when I bought it, the only doubt I have is the fuel pump itself. One more thing I did cover the intake boot in high temperature silicone and I let it fully cure(dry) to see if there were any air leaks in the intake boot. Of course that didn't seem to make a difference so I am taking it as there were no air leaks. Please if anyone has any more suggestions I would greatly appreciate them. My friends swear this thing was easy to start before. Oh you can't pull start it either the starter seems to be engaged when you pull the pull start cord? I am guessing the clutch that engages when the starter turns is either froze up from sitting around or needs replaced? Thanks again to everyone who replied so far for your time and to those who have any more ideas on the matter.

 

I should add the fuel pump is vacuum operated.

 

First off the intake boot itself is not the problem air leaks on the intake side of the carb are not going to make any difference in how it runs... Take the cover off the air filter and remove air filter then install intake air boot to carb. it should run fine.. then install the air filter it should still run fine, now put cover on air filter if it then dies or won't start I would look at the air intake tube, if its like my 01 then there is ia rubber boot on the top of the air intake tube by the under the shifter lever covers. if that has worked loose and slid up it could be pressing against the top of the plastic cowling and not letting air in.. next look for obstruction in the air intake system like a mouse living in the tube somewhere...
the fuel pump only keeps fuel in the fuel bowl from your description it should not be and issue unless its pumping air into the fuel line which will cause carb to run rough. check fuel lines for cracks. I would clean up the fuel pump like you did the carb though

 

Thanks again to everyone who replied to my post. I actually just got the King Quad back again. The "hard starting" issue is still not resolved. The quad actually just changed owners to another family member who thought they could fix it and they have given up. OK, here is what has been done since last time. The new owner installed a new piston and rings. When he put it back together he maid sure it was in time. We do not know if it was out of time before I never got that far when I gave up last time. So, now it has excellent compression, I checked the timing myself and made sure it is in proper time and it is. The new owner said it still is so hard to start and ended up burning the starter up because he couldn't get it to start. He did say that with the rubber boot from the carb to the airbox removed it would fire right up. It would run ok but of course without the airbox the upper rpm range would suffer. So, I adjusted the valves on it and I am waiting on the new starter to show up. I tried to start it with the pull start and it has excellent compression actually so much it is just too difficult to start with the pull start. I still don't understand why the boot from the carb to the airbox has to be off for it to start up? I tried connecting the airbox and rubber boot and removing the air filter but it still won't start. Once it starts up it will idle and run fine. You can put the boot back on between the airbox and carb and no problems. I ran it around for 30 minutes that way and shut if off and hit the starter button and it won't start again. Remove the boot from the airbox to the carb and it fires right back up? I was thinking fuel pump but I really have no idea? Would the fuel pump cause this? It is hard to start but once running it runs fine? I am at a loss on this one? HELP!! Anyone I am open to any suggestions. Once I get the new starter in I am going to clean the air filter and try that. I may end up having the new owner try an new intake boot and if that doesn't work a new fuel pump. After that I am not sure? I checked the spark again and it has good spark. Thanks again in advance of anyone with a similar machine or past experiece that can help.

 

Hard starting!



Check to see that the exhaust valves are not to tight! This will cause hard starting.

 

I should also add that I ran the VIN number and it is a 2000 King Quad 300 4X4, and not a 1997 like I previously thought. Sorry about that.

 

Normally if you crank and crank on it usually indicates that the valves are just a touch out of adjustment, I would just loosen them just a quarter turn on the set screw tighten it back up and try it. If it doesn't fix the problem obviously you can change it back but it may be worth the 10 minutes to try and see if it fixes it.


THOMAS

 

Thanks Tubbytubb. I did adjust the valves the other day. Unfortunately the owner burned up the starter and the compression is way to much for me to keep pull starting the quad. So, I will let you know if the valve adjustment did the trick when I get the new starter in. I did notice the exhaust valve had no tolerance and the intake valve was at .004. So I don't have a manual for a king quad but I do have one for several Yamaha 4X4 quads. They recommended .008 for the exhuast and .004 for the intake. I adjusted the valves to this and when pull starting it it seemed like it wanted to start. A sore arm made me give up but I am hopeful that this will solve the problem. Let me know if you or anyone else reading this post knows the actual setting for the valves for a King Quad? Thanks in advance if someone does post the correct tolerances. I also talked to the owner today and went over the quad. He did put a new fuel pump on, spark plug boot, and as previously mentioned rebuilt the top end with new rings and gaskets. I am running out of ideas as we are replacing items. We are down to replacing the intake boot and finally rebuilding the carb is none of the previous steps don't work? The spark is great no problems there. I will keep everyone posted. In the mean time please if anyone has those tolerances for the valve clearences reply with them. Thanks everyone again for all of your help.

 

.003-.005 INT & .006-.008 EXH at least that is what the local dealer had told me on mine.



THOMAS

 

Thomas,
Thank you for the information. I greatly appreciate it.

 

Hey I meant to ask how many miles does your quad have on it, I learned something very important regarding the valves that could be causing the problem your having also. Also when you are turning it over does it look like fuel is spitting out of the back of the carb, away from the engine?


THOMAS

 

Thomas,
I don't know because the previous owners grandchildren rolled the quad and broke the speedometer. Anyhow, I asked one of the grandchildren and he said he thought there were roughly 2000 miles on it when that happened. The new owner just rebuilt the top end. To answer your other question yes it does spit fuel out of the back of the carb when trying to start it. Let me know your thoughts? Thanks in advance.

Ryan

 

You need to ask the new owner if he had done any work on the head (with the valves in it) if he didn't visually inspect the valve there may be a chance that the INTAKE valve is starting to wear and making it not seal properly and it will cause the adjustment on the valves to be constantly off if that is what is wrong with it.

You can see in the picture above that the valve head only has a single angle on it instead of the customary 3 angle (the reason for 3 angle valve job). This normally starts happening consistently around 2500 miles but depending on how it was ridden it could happen before then. This also would explain why it spits fuel out of the rear because the valve is not completely sealing the combustion chamber from the intake and the excess pressure is being released back through the carburetor and because the carb works off of a vacuum it makes it spit fuel out of the back. I cannot guarantee that this is what is causing your situation but there is, in my opinion, a strong possibility that it could be. The guy that does my machine work told me about this and he has been doing it for 15 years and he says every king quad he has worked on has had the exact same thing happen to it, odd thing is the exhaust valve is never effected like that they seem to last a whole lot longer without issues.



THOMAS

 

Thomas,
Thanks! I never thought about the valve surface doing that and after looking at the picture you posted that makes sense. Ever since the previous owner got it out of storage it has spit fuel out of the back of the carb. I am going to put the new starter in tonight and see if it will fire up. If it doesn't which now knowing what you have told me I don't think it will I will have to look at the valves. I know for a fact the new owner did not do any valve work, just piston, rings and gaskets. Now if it is the intake valve can I replace it or do I have to have the valve seat resurfaced and lapped?
I have never done much with valve work other than adjusting them. So this will be a new experience for me. I do know that the quad was abused by the previous owners grandchildren. They never took good care of it and ran it very hard. Sorry just being honest here. I wish I knew the exact mileage like I said the one grandchild said it had around 2k on it when he rolled it and broke the speedometer. So I am guessing it started being hard to start when the other grand child worked on it and broke the fuel petcock and they gave up. Just a guess. Well let me know about the resurfacing and I will let you know how I make out with trying to start it tonight. The new owner did say that when he put new the new rings and gaskets in would fire up every time but after a while it became hard to start again. Thanks again! I really appreciate the information!
Ryan

 

That will all depend on what it looks like when you get into it. I was lucky enough I didn't have to get mine resurfaced but I am assuming that is because the valve seats are harder than the valves which is a "good" thing and part of what causes it to happen. When you put the starter in tonight I bet if it doesn't start you can adjust the valves, I can tell you a fast and easy way to get a rough set on them to keep from having to break out the feeler gauges, and it will crank right up and run for a little while but then after it warms up it probably won't crank back up. Let me know how it goes and I will do what I can to help you out on getting it fixed.



THOMAS

 

Well tonight was uneventful because the starter clutch kept slipping. The new starter kept turning and the engine wouldnt turn over. So I called the owner and he said he had this apart during the rebuild. He also said there were pieces laying in the case and they put them back in place. I will have to take the cover off and see what is going on? I'm willing to bet something isn't in the right place or the starter clutch is shot? I also noticed when I try and pull start it the starter turns also? It sounds like the starter clutch is engaged all of the time? One other thing should it have so much compression I can barely pull start it?

 

The cogs are probably stuck outward or even one of them came out and is stuck in between the clutch and the starter gear either way you will need a new starter clutch. The starter turning when you pull start it is a tell-tell sign of the starter clutch being screwed, I had the exact same thing happen not long ago and that is how I knew it was the SC. Yes with a recent rebuild if it is done right it will literally wear your arm out and hurt your hand when you try to pull start it because it has all of it's compression and everything isn't completely broke in also. One other thing that can cause it to be hard to pull start is that the valves aren't 100% correct and they are not opening correctly, Did you try to use the compression release?



THOMAS

 

I figured that about the starter clutch. Well he will have to get a new one as well as purchase a puller. Figures! I did use the compression release last night and it did make it easier to pull start it. Of course after each pull I would have to flip the lever again but I still couldn't get it to start. So I will call the owner and see if he wants to purchase a new starter clutch? I looked on bikebandit and they sell them as a kit for around $190. The puller is going to be around $40. The current owner said he is getting to the point of giving up. Really he didn't need to rebuild it he probably could have gotten away with adjusting the valves for a while and then putting in an intake valve. He put a lot of money into stuff that didn't need to be replaced. I'll keep you posted. Thanks again!

 

I should add I was thinking about trying to start it by pulling it with my other atv? Or should I wait? I don't want to ruin the new starter. I'm not sure if it starts if it will keep spinning the starter? Thanks.

 

Just to clarify I wasn't trying to sound rude or anything if I did. http://www.mrcycles.com/fiche_secti..._section_detail.asp?section=81025&category=ATVs&make=SUZUKI&year=1996&fveh=1858 They have the whole set for $160. I would wait because it will stay engaged when it starts and will burn up that new starter. I'm not sure where you are located but I would just go to AutoZone and rent one because you will only use it for literally 5 minutes to remove the clutch. I would just wait on cranking it until you get a new clutch because 1. your going to hurt your arm trying to pull start it and 2. one of those cogs could wreak all kind of hell on the internal parts especially if it gets in the sub-trans gears or the stator. I just don't want it to become useless to try and fix it and end up having to spend more than is necessary. If the compression release didn't make it any easier odds are the valves aren't just right, I would loosen the set screws on the valves a 1/4 turn each and see if that helps in pull starting it just to see if it lessens the strain on your arm. If he is willing to pay for the parts I will do everything I can to help you get it worked out. Have you ever torn into one of these King Quads before? If not I have a post on here that will probably help you.



THOMAS

 

No I didn't think you were rude at all. I appreciate all the advice you have given me so far and plan on loosening the valves a quarter turn tomorrow to see if that helps. Thanks for the website info too. Hopefully the owner doesn't want to give up at this point. I'll keep you posted. At this point all it needs is a starter clutch and depending on the valves maybe an intake valve. I do have an autozone close by. I didn't know they rented flywheel pullers? That's great! Thanks again.

 

I forgot to answer the last question no I have never tore one of these apart. I'll look for your other post. Thanks again.